One of the highlights of the ERW Central Event in Zaragoza was a panel discussion on the theme of ‘Women in robotics working in a world of AI’
In a departure from the rest of the English language-only event, the event host Steve Doswell set the questions and conducted the panel discussion in Spanish and English, the three Spanish panellists spoke in their mother tongue while euRobotics senior project officer Javier Luque impressively summarised the panellists’ comments from his native Spanish into English and instantly relayed these back to the international audience who were listening and watching in the auditorium at ITA, the Aragon Institute of Technology.
The three panellists were:
Montserrat Grañeras Pastrana, (MG) Director of the Office of the Secretary of State for Education, with effect from August 2024, and previously head of the gender equality unit at the Ministry of Education.
Nieves Pavón-Pulido (NP), Professor of Systems Engineering and Automation at the Polytechnic University of Cartagena
Pilar Mollá Ortiga (PM), Quantum Software Developer and AI for Healthcare Developer, representing the global IT Services company NTT DATA and also the ASTI Foundation, which develops programmes to promote the teaching of STEM subjects.
The following text is an edited version of Javier’s summary of the discussion.
Q1: How can we encourage girls into science, technology, engineering and mathematics education – the so-called STEM subjects?
MG: The first thing of all is to agree that there is a gender gap. We should analyse statistics and data to see how this gender gap evolves. From the Ministry of Education, they see that there is a brain drain of women in STEAM.
NP: There is a gap as well in healthcare. Why are there so few men in healthcare? Maybe, women feel themselves more oriented towards “care” (in general terms) while men feel oriented towards other things. Should we give complete freedom? We are not forcing men to study healthcare disciplines to reach a gender balance, so why women in STEAM?
PM: We need positive discrimination. Programmes enhancing positive discrimination are necessary as we need to reach equity. Girls should grow in a diverse environment.
Q2. Is it enough to encourage and enable girls to study STEM subjects at school? Is there then a natural momentum that will take them on to pursue these subjects in higher education and then to make careers in science and technology? Or is something additional needed to increase the presence of women in these professional fields?
MG: We are creating a paradox. When we place AI at the centre of society, women suffer a need to flee. A breach is then produced. At the moment, we are very far from reaching 50/50 in these disciplines. Therefore, society is not going in the right direction. Women need to be present in the construction of that world. Society needs more men and women in STEAM disciplines. Therefore, positive discrimination is needed. With positive discrimination, a better world could be reached. Education is key but is not the only thing. We need big alliances such as the STEAM Alliance which includes universities, professors, families, etc. In addition, we need a national strategy to tackle this problem.
PM: We need more role models. Models in high level positions are not very visible. For instance, women in big corporations. Making women visible like the panellists is OK, but we should put the emphasis on big profiles. Education is, of course, key, but we need state funds to help women’s inclusion in STEAM.
NP: For many decades, technology has been on the rise. However, the focus should not be the technology itself but the problems we can solve with that technology. What drives us as human beings are the problems we need to solve. Of course, if women studied more STEAM disciplines, feminine unemployment would decrease. But we should not only focus on their vocation and future career plans but also on society. We should ask: what can I do for society? Instead of: what society can do for me?
Two examples would be: (firstly) the application of AI to solve human problems (here NP gave the example of the floods in Valencia). With AI we might have been able to foresee these and close roads, evacuate people and so on. Therefore, the damages would have been less dramatic. And (secondly) the current urgent need in Spain to solve the problem of care of the elderly.
Q3. Let’s move the discussion on to another important theme and that’s the question of ethics surrounding AI and the regulation required for AI to be used safely. I know that this is a topic of personal interest to Pilar, so Pilar, can you start us off on this topic?
PM: Yes, this is a topic of personal interest. Currently, we have a need to regulate. Regulation is behind the present reality. In 2024, the EU published the AI Act which tackles the basic risks. However, we need to ensure that AI accomplishes a series of requirements: responsibility, fairness, transparency, privacy, and internationality.
In her response, Montserrat made reference at this point to Guidelines on the use of AI in education . MG: It’s very necessary to bear in mind the biases of AI. One of the main biases is gender bias. It is not the same to build AI with or without considering gender bias. In addition to this, we also need to bear in mind economic inequalities that may provoke children’s exclusion. Are families able to offer their children the same opportunities? Can schools create a positive discrimination against vulnerable students? (She also mentioned Spain’s National Strategy on AI)
NP: AI is on trend right now but it has been developing since the 1960s. Regarding privacy issues, it seems to be on the rise now but, on the other hand, we all accept that big social media corporations have all the data. And we are all accepting the privacy policies they have (without any big problems). We should ask ourselves some questions such as: should ethics tackle everything? What do we need to do? Which problems society has? Why do we need ChatGPT? Should engineers be the first ones that should question ethics concepts? Are we doing this now just because it is on trend? Why are we scandalising ourselves with AI but not with weapons? Which is the main aim while we teach our students? Good is an absolute concept. And we need to teach with that in mind.
Q4. Final perspectives
MG: Technology is the “how” (not the “what). The most important thing is to see technology as an ally to solve our problems and create a better world. The easiest thing should be attracting women to technology with this idea.
PM: We need to focus on biases. AI is generated by society and society has biases, inter alia, gender bias. [PM gave an example of how a few years ago she began asking ChatGPT and the replies were gender-biased (especially, since the Spanish language has gendered (masculine and feminine) grammatical features, with the masculine form used by default). Today, it seems the bias has improved. We need to see AI as an ally not as a threat.
Nieves offered her personal story as an example of the importance of technology. Her father was a shepherd in Extremadura (south-west Spain) and the family was poor. However, her father managed to sustain the family and send the children to university. She then studied technology and managed to have a decent economic situation. Technology as a life-changer.